DFA board

[juan]

I've more or less sat idly by for most of the LCD Sellout System debates, and I know James and others already adressed the NIke thing, but the Nike thing got me so riled up I want to go formally on record as having made my viewpoint clear on this issue of 'selling out.' (and it's nice to use this board for it's perhaps most important purpose purpose for me, bridging the gap of inaccessability between artists and artists).

'Selling out' was an idea that gained popularity around the time of punk rock. It referred to bands who once had attained credibility by doing whatever the fuck they wanted, musically, and then somehow compromising that credibiity by altering their sound or otherwise making concessions because of the demands of, more often than not, a major label that the band had signed with presumably to make more money. This was an entirely valid accusation at the time. 'Punk' bands would sign to a major label and become metal-ish. Or pop-ier. Or mohawks would be grown out into teassed hair. Or Nirvana would sound like Boston. ad nauseum. This was all pre-internet, pre-downloading, at a time when there really was an 'independant' music scene.

I'm sorry to rain on your slip on Vans, but their has not been a true 'indie rock' scene for at least a decade. I am not saying this bitterly, as someone who 'was there' at the time as both an avid fan and member of a band on one of the premier indie labels and is now somehow disenchanted and cyncial. It just is what it is. As an aside, I prefer the present situation anyway. I don't have to work painting houses or construction or selling drugs in order to maintain my indie credibility anymore.

With the advent of the internet, local scenes or regionally defined movements are moot identifiers. i can go to Tel-Aviv and sell out a show packed with Israelis who own the entire DFA catalog and are trading in pre-DFA rough mixes of unreleased future DFA acts. I can play in Athens, Greece (next month) or Athens, Georgia, and chances are fans in Greece will be more up for it than the indie damaged people of collegiate Athens, Ga. People don't walk into record stores, rifle through racks of 'indie' releases, pick up fanzines to learn about more bands, trade mix tapes with friends to learn about more bands, etc. It's all readily available 24 hours a day on the internet, which for me, has been an enormous blessing as an artist, and endlessly exciting as a fan. It has made the idea of some dude on his laptop chopping up beats from a Lipps Inc. track and laying some synth bits on top in Derbyshire to be released on a label in Germany and then used in a Volkswagon commercial not seem retardedly far-fetched and the musings of an insane person, but an every day occurance. You tell me, would you really rather hear, when subjected to a tv commercial, Dave Mathews or Hootie or would you rather hear Aphex Twin? Only a self-important tosser who couldn't pay girls to lay with him would ever want a world that has maintained a spurious indie credibility over a world in which the loonies of music is a part of our cultural landscape.

The LCD Nike thing is one of my favorite pieces of music to ever emerge from the DFA dungeon. Right now it's my favourite. Nike never said a word to James, as far as I know, about the content of the music. I mean Jesus Fucking Christ, there's a part in it about a sad spaceship or something talking sadly in a pitched down sad-robot voice some outer space retardedness. Nike for fuck's sake! BTW, I only wear Nike, The Juan MacLean's Nick only ever wears them too, I think he has 300 pairs of AF1's in his room. And you know what? Nike are a corporate giant, they have overseas factories with workers who make $3 a day, they probably rake in billions every year. And if you are upset by that, then look at all the clothes you have on right now and if you are wearing, say, Levis, then throw yourself off a bridge right now you fucking hypocrite. If you are that upset about it, don't right into forums, go put yourself on the line and DO something about, work for an organization that is dedicated to improving work conditions, etc.

If there is one thing I have learned at this point in my old age, it's that the dudes crying 'sell out' are, ah, always dudes. If they do have the enormous luck to somehow find themselves having a girlfriend, they don't even have the good sense to allow her to like Souvlaki Stephens or Death Cab for Cuntie or whatever in the interest of smoothing the way for outrageous sexual requests. They have trust funds, or at least have never lived under threat of financial ruin. They grew up in communities where all the children were above average. They have never actually produced or made or created anything that would require them to commit to any sort of aesthetic or belief that could be judged, except for their daily deposits in the toilet.

And at the end of the day, they never think that someone will punch them in the face for being called a sellout pussy (hello Jesse, I know you're reading this!).

[TreeZy]

[LucY]

[thom]

Perhaps this sort of advertising does work though. Listening to 45:33 I remembered I wanted to buy a new pair of dunks, so I went out today and spent a good portion of all the money I have in the World on a snazzy black and blue pair. Now I'm super psyched about them, and I owe it all to James Murphy.

James may have "sold out" to some people, but he actually improved my shoe collection.

[nick]

james has actually ruined nike for me. I am in the process of bagging and tossing my 300 pairs of AF1s, dunks and air maxes as I just can't wear them without crying.

[thom]

Hey, if you're chucking that shit out send me the dunks. I suddenly have a massive hard-on for them.

[TreeZy]

Juan, reading your post pretty much reminds me why i love you lot so much,

i personally don't really come from either indie or dance background really, tho would say slightly more dance if asked, i can't really genirise what i listen to, i'm a bit cluless when it comes to being a genre guy, its either good or bad, which is initially where Under The Trees came into my equation.

anyhows,

i had a slight re-action because its Nike, who James admits that even HE, the artist, wasn't overly keen on the intial idea, but then thought about it and the challenge set that is pretty amazing, AND Nike never said shit about its content, leaving me even more loving it!!!(coz its a SHIT HOT 45 mins!!!)

My little reaction to start with was purely coz i thought the music was isolated into the trainer and you had to buy a pair of i-pod nikes to listen (yeah as i said i live in cloud cuckoo land))

BUT,

Same as James(once you take a proper look, and more importantly listen),and when you've listened and looked about and put it in its proper place, you have to admit that there is no selling out, and i've never used that term. It doesn't really fit for makin music, selling out is worse than makin or sellin any musics, just as long as everyone can get it in my opinion and that is fine!!!

It is one of the most jaw dropping tracks to come from you guys, and is seriously HOT, and re-freshing.

I know that James couldn't have made a better move making that music and you, Sir Juan, bta be droppin some of that shit into your sets at fabric!!!

The opener. That would be killer, then use records there after, but what a trip you've sent me on.

Inspiring musics at its BEST!!!

Nice of you to but in Juan. I enjoyed reading your thoughts on the subject to be true, i honestly think that you guys rule and have a love of music that surpasses a logo, brand or even dare i say it AN INDUSTRY.

The DFA now wouldn't be the same if it wasn't for 45.33 so i think we should all leave this there untill we get the vinyl:)

Its a superb track. Of EPIC proportions!!! ---> and has all the love and dedication put into it to make it an LCD soundsystem track, BELONGING in the DFA catalogue!!!

---> really. it just wouldn't be the same without it now.

I'm trying to explain to nearly everyone i know what has sort of happened and how good the results are!!!

People are REALLY interested when i tell them what James has made as opposed to another DFA remix or whatever, EVERYONE is interested in what you guys would make, and i think quite a lot will get the track out of pure musical interest to hear LCd's interpretaion of this. (and so they fuckin should!!!)

Its exciting and new. Respect for the track. and if its helped LCD Soundsystems new album AS WELL!!!

Then we all got a whole new world comin or something when James finally puts us out of our misery with the next installment in the LCD legend.

When people hear that Nike shit they will love it. Its soo deep and disturbingly good that if you are NOT proud of it being on the DFA cat list you need to get a life!!!

Thats all i can think to say. What a tune!!!

---> as nick said,

SERIOUSLY!!!

TreeZy x

[The Inventor]

[TreeZy]

what do i class as???

loony or twat. think carefully. am i in the indstry???

Inventor. Life chagnging shit goin down here (for the bezzie)

---> hit me with your worst. Or your rhythm stick.

I need some outside info i can only gain outside if you see///

TreeZy x

[bollo x]

the whole sell out thing is just jealousy
there are poeple now getting well paid to do a job that there
good at. which then allows a more creative freedom.

as long as poeple are awear of the shit happeneing in the world
im happy, then its up to them what they do, its doesnt make them a bad or a good person. its their choice to do with it what they like.

anyway
BX

[TreeZy]

chk your pms bublin:)

[james]

i have to defend something bizzare: i don't think it's entirely irrelevant, the idea of selling out--i'm just often pretty dubious about people's definitions, etc., and i take exception to being called out about something that i'm this pleased with by people who haven't heard the fucking music.

i mean, i this is one my favorite things i've ever made--i'm as proud of this as of anything else--and it's either going to be pretty invisible and nike and apple are not going to do much with it, in which case i get it back anyway and i'm happy, OR they're going to somehow push it into the "mainstream", whatever that means now, which is pretty hilarious. i mean, as juan said, it's a 45 minute disco track about space featuring singing spaceships and singing stars, etc., and if it were somehow "successful", i think that would make me smile over my coffee in the morning.

as it is, in reality it's not going to make nike sell any more shoes than they already sell, or apple sell any more ipods than they already sell--that's just the truth. i think they know that. it's why i could negotiate for total creative control (they didn't even have the right to respond about the track, contractually--it was simply "if you like it, you use it under these terms, and if you don't like it, we use it however we like")--because it didn't "reflect" on them the way an advertisement would. honestly, they just wanted something that could "go with" those funny shoes they made, but--being a global super-brand--couldn't resist putting a logo on the cover of the thing, which i intentionally let them do with their comedy colors so it was obvious, aesthetically, that there was me and there was them.

to be honest, i was partly hoping that they would reject it so i could use some of the songs on 12"s right now, but, in the end, i think it's better the way it is--i mean, this would be a very hard thing to turn into dfa and EMI--"oh here--put this out," i mean--i'm about to release a new album, and i'd drop this on them?

anyway, i think it's a strange thing to be asked to do, and my manager totally thought i was going to tell him to shove it up his ass when he mentioned it to me--i mean, he was like "ok, this thing came in, and i'm pretty sure i know what you're going to say", and i totally blew it off--but i'd been thinking a lot about E2-E4 by gottesching and had realized that i'd never get to make something like that really--i mean, i could MAKE it, but that's different than making it to have it be released as something other than a novelty--and so, after reading the brief and realizing that it wasn't an advertisement per se, realizing that i'd get it back and would have control over it, i decided to go for it.

i certainly wasn't trying to make people work out, or buy shoes, or ipods or whatever. i wasn't trying to further the nike brand, or extend its already seemingly limitless cultural clutches into whatever consists of "my world" or anything like that. i just wanted to make a sprawling disco thing that bummed jocks out by being way too gay, and made me happy, distracting me from the brain-melting pressure of making a second album (ask juan about that) and went out into the world with no promo work from me or dfa (no interviews, press photos, etc.) all i had to do was write that ridiculous liner note package, which no one seems to get to tone of anyway. i mean, it's all corporate doubletalk, for fuck's sake, (though i do actually do the jiu jitsu, which totally rules and i couldn't reccomend more).

anyway, i've said too much, so i'm going back into the studio to work on the record, even though it's sunday, and so amazingly lovely out, sunny and cold--the best kind of new york day--and the studio is in a windowless basement with the worst ventilation known to man, mold in the airducts etc., where eric broucek and i can simply pass one mutation of the flu back and forth between us over and over for the next few months until one of us goes on tour or dies--whichever comes first.

and, to be totally honest, it's an honor.

[TreeZy]

James i love you///

bummed out jock.

i'm now a bummed out jog who does 1 more press up each day.

fuck you man. i AM taking that jog.

take from it i shall so i will;)

and excercise is where its at. Good to see you gays talkin about real life tho.

Its good to know your stuck in some baasment James,

it makes me feel honoured i live and get to make my music to a big VICTORIAN window looking out onto the city park and i can see nothing but TREES:)

Go forth and lay the seeds Sir James.

TreeZy x

[The Inventor]

[james]